I think Epic was very arrogant in their approach assuming consumers have no self control over buying things, so assumed they’d get them no matter what if they made things exclusive to their store. That pissed off vocal people would still not be able to resist not buying games.

Which actually is not a bad bet to make, but turned out to surprisingly not work as well as they hoped it would. And led to lingering animosity towards them that is still around years later.

And they still seem lost when it comes to trying to figure out how to win consumers over. It’s like they got advice from Randy Pitchford from 2K telling them the way to win consumers over is to berate them and attack the competition.

Consoles are completely locked down so there is only one store you can buy from. Consoles are a safer bet that lost hardware sales would lead to making it up on games.

But, Steam Machine is a PC. Not only can you install games from outside the Steam store. You are able to completely replace the OS. You can have a completely Steamless experience on it.

I wouldn’t mind if this led to devs stopping the constant push for heavier graphics in games and instead moved to making sure they run well with how upgrading is looking to be less and less feasible for more people.

I like that I dont have to bother going into desktop mode with Steam games compared to heroic launcher.

Depends on if it’s a game I’ll also be playing on the Steam Deck and not just on ny desktop. There is heroic launcher, but I prefer the Steam Linux experience.

Him not ordering support for Fortnite on Linux says it all about how serious he actually is about wanting to escape OS ecosystems like Apple, Google, and Windows. He doesn’t care about alternatives.

His only goal is getting more profit, since when it comes to supporting movements that would help Linux grow that might allow him to not be at the mercy of other corporations he chooses to do nothing. As long as he makes profit he is happy to be on copilot riddled Windows and spyware Google Android. He would rather spend money courts, and considers Linux a waste of money to put resources towards.

Yep all those people not liking the idea of AI labels telling on themselves. For how much the AI bros talk up AI they are incredibly skittish about having to show what products were created using it. If it is so awesome why the fear?

Like an artist who traces their drawings, but doesn’t want to disclose it so more people will assume they free handed it.

Costco charges an annual membership to shop there. Walmart doesn’t. Both market offering low prices. Costco focuses on good customer support for their customers and good warranty policies and treats their employees better. And prices are cheap with them focusing on bulk and rotating out items that don’t sell well to maintain that. And with inflation Costco has become more popular to try to save money on goods since they sell stuff like food too. Unlike Costco, Walmart has a reputation of entering into new territories cutting prices, putting local stores out of business due to inability to compete with their prices, then raise prices once they’ve secured their territory. They are however both stores selling stuff at the end.

Anyways, some don’t care, and a product is a product so membership to them is seen as bloat the way you see the Steam launcher. So it all depends on perceived value. I understand your disdain for steam if you find no value in it, but for me playnite doesn’t meet my needs. Nor have I had issues with Steam being resource heavy. Its just not a thing that bothers me, but I do understand your point of view and that perceived value on your end won’t change just as mine won’t change. We are different customers with the only similarity of intersection being interest in games, but expectations on features being very different.

Gambling mechanic is as impactful to me as Costco selling alcohol and junk food. I don’t play those games, so only reason I’m even aware of it is because of people bringing it up. Those who seek it out can get it those who come for other things can avoid it.

And I like the steam launcher when it comes to linux compatibility, steam workshop, reviews, categorizing my games, note function, and gamepad support. I absolutely would not want to go back to the old days of CDs for games. Too many to manage and keep track of. And I like my Steam Deck for introducing me to Linux gaming, and being one of the few launchers that actually has Linux support and doesn’t need to rely on third party work arounds.

Those who don’t value that can buy from Epic or other launchers the way some people don’t see the difference buying from Costco vs Walmart and see membership fees as a waste of money. Or go over to consoles to be free of launchers entirely.

I’d say the only thing that bothers me about Steam is that you can’t completely ignore updates for games, so have to go into offline mode or save a copy then update then replace the directory or use steam console to retrieve the old version if you accidentally updated. That’s been my only gripe as a Steam user for games like Skyrim where I don’t want updates.

I think difference is EA is more a game company so people see a game they like then judge the monetization because its a full priced game that turns out to have f2p monetization.

But, Valve is more judged for its experience as a launcher and less for its games. So with the launcher itself being the draw things like Valve game lootboxes can be something people are completely unexposed to as they play other games.

But, EA is still at a stage where the products that receive the most visibility are their games, and the launcher and services side so underwhelming it isn’t a selling point.

Its like Costco versus a company known for its pizza. Costco is a warehouse store people love going to that happens to sell pizza, but is judged on multiple things that draw them there over other stores as opposed to pizza. A pizza company is just known primarily for its pizza so judged on the quality of their pizza.

Yeah. Only reason I mention hours not being so important is because I’ve bought many games that are 5-10 hour experiences because I found the aspects like the atmosphere, story, or gameplay very compelling.

On a per hour basis The Finals has been the clear winner for me past 2 years its been out dropping over a hundred hours a year with no money spent. And enjoying more than paid multiplayer games.

Unreal engine drive by AI with more AI for an AI powered AI peoples AI solution. AI the new AI buzz word thrown into everything to excite AI investors. AI AI with extra AI. Money please AI.

2 hour movies are also competing with streaming services like Netflix where people can see many more hours of TV shows and movies for less. Some just stick to youtube which requires no money and has some free movies there too.

Its like how people can drop hundreds and thousands of hours on f2p games without spending any money. $/hr valuation is outdated.

To be convinced to spend, consumer has to be convinced what a game is offering is unique to other cheaper and sometimes free alternatives. $/hr is something they will have a hard time competing with.

Have you tried using a keyboard for fighting games? That’s another set up that can help reduce use of thumbs, and closer to hitboxes so easier to pull off dpad specific moves.

Something I’ve seen commonly done is wasd for movement then using the numpad rows for stuff like punches and kicks.

Have you tried foot pedal? I wonder if that is allowed in tournaments.

You don’t even have to release your game on pc to sell… Some don’t at all. Sticking to only consoles.

If someone really wants adobe they can replace steamos with windows or dualboot or maybe boot windows off a external ssd they installed it on.

They can do that on a cheap previous gen console or a potato laptop.

Yep. Trying to type with anything but a keyboard sucks. I love my k400. I’ve had it for years and years. Not sure how old it is but I think I got it during the PS3/360 era for PC TV use and it still works. And batteries last so long on it.

And is actually usable as a desktop being able to run things like blender, krita, gimp, obs, etc.

Hardware support is something I’d trust more from Valve than other companies if something goes wrong too. So if cost is comparable better perceived customer support would have me lean towards Valve.

I would be more useful to see a device breakdown on a per game basis. Like hardware used to play Cyberpunk 2077 is probably going to be higher on average than Counter Strike.

There’s posts this month, so might be the case if on beehaw.

Thanks for bringing attention to this cool game. Would never have heard of it otherwise. And the reasons for the criticisms ended up convincing me to try the game, since it sounds like the dev is really cool.

Its become Cartmanland to me. I want to check it out. I wouldn’t pay for it, but I want to check it out.

I don’t think most people shoot for higher than console specs or even upgrade as often as people think. Like I’m on AM4 which is a last gen chipset and on a 3000 series gpu which is 2 gpu generations ago.

And with stuff like dlss it’s extended how often people need to upgrade to hit fps targets. Like I’m still able to play at over 100 fps. All the ones talking up the latest video cards and cpus are pretty much seeking next gen performance and graphics, and they are outliers based on steam hardware surveys.

Me. I don’t see myself upgrading until the next console gen when hardware requirements will go up again.

And not everyone wants to build a pc, and there’s people who’ve been happy with the performance of the Deck. So not all pc gamers are the stereotypical must max everything out crowd. So for them getting something more powerful than the Deck would would be for them. And for some like me PC flexibility when it comes to mods, tweaks, and being able to use whatever preferred input they want is the draw than the graphics.

I actually think PC gamers care less about graphics than console users, since we want more frames. Like during the PS3 era I was willing to drop my resolution to 720p and go to low to hit 60 fps if necessary. But, later on the PS4 that was considered sacrilege, and games like Bloodborne released at 30 fps despite later some modder showing bloodborne could have ran close to 60 if the console hadn’t been obessed with maxing resolution. We will take lower resolution and lower graphics settings to get higher frames compared to what consoles who prioritize graphics over frames.

I actually used to be a console gamer and was a big part of why I shifted over to PC as my main. I got sick of consoles choosing graphics over performance. And decided to go to PC where I could make the decision for myself.

As for me if the Steam Machine is cheap enough or goes on sale for around the base price of the Deck in the future I might just pick it up to use as a secondary PC on my other monitor.

Pretty much why in my first comment it was addressing PC gamers to try using a HDMI cable if they want to play on the TV. Wasn’t directed towards console gamers to get a PC.

Steam machine will require same troubleshooting, since it is in the end a PC that lets you install any games even if it isn’t compatible. And will require sometimes to go to a site like protondb to see which proton version is compatible to get the game running.

Steam machine is more an entry for those interested in getting into PCs that isnt super expensive.

Kind of funny this long conversation ended up being with a console gamer than my intended target demographic. So I kept wondering why is this pc gamer so resistant to hdmi cables.

Well yeah that’s just comes with being a PC. But, if you already got your games set up not really much need to do troubleshooting when TV gaming.

Like you can go on and on and on trying to find issues, but main point is for PC gamers who already have a gaming PC hdmi cable and controller is generally all that is needed to game on the TV. So they can save on needing another system just for the purpose of playing on a TV.

At that point if a PC is as troublesome as you keep making it out to be a Steam Machine or Steam Deck isn’t going to be any better if you truly want a simple as possible system like the console.

Steam Big picture mode you don’t even need to bother with that. It can all be done through controller.

If you are familiar with Steam Deck that’s basically big picture mode.

And I just keep my K400 at the couch since that’s only time I use it. Sometimes I feel like browsing web a bit on the TV, or in game might want to utilize text chat. I use my PC to play video files to watch movies and shows, so pretty much multiple reasons for me beyond gaming.

No more crap than just playing on a monitor.

I’m using the k400 to navigate desktop. I’m using my controller to play games. Kind of weird to go through the set up of playing on the couch in front of a TV away from the desk and thinking about using a mouse and keyboard instead of a controller.

Not an issue either. If you can have the money for a fiber optic hdmi cable then you have the money for a powered usb cable to extend the wireless range.

I’ve been gaming on PC that wasn’t near my TV for years since back during the 360/PS3 era. And hdmi and usb cable is all that’s been needed to get started. Nothing more complicated beyond that.

And OS front end? There’s Steam big picture mode or just use a cheap wireless keyboard like the K400 to navigate the desktop. You are talking to pc gamers who built a powerful pc. Im not talking about this set up to some console player and trying to convert them to PC. And I’m not trying to convince someone who wants a dedicated system for the TV so might want a dumbed down UI, but someone who has a powerful PC they use for desktop use and gaming and wants to play on the TV too without moving their PC.

Just showing there is a cheap affordable option using existing powerful hardware that one already has on hand if they want to also utilize it on their TV. But if someone insist on dropping hundreds or thousands more for a secondary system to play on the TV that’s fine too.

What’s to keep Windows from deciding to get rid of allowing people to install any exe? What’s to stop them from deciding to charge a 30% fee of all transactions from exes that they allow to be published? Whats to stop them from banning Steam, Epic, GOG from existing on their OS so everything is through the Microsoft Store?

What if? What if?

When has Android been open? How many people do you know building their own parts to make their own Android phone from random parts? Android has mostly been at the mercy of OEM prebuilts.

Original Steam controller felt like it was made with really cheap looking materials to cut costs.

This controller looks like the build quality is much more premium and has a lot of inputs and tech put in than the expensive Xbox Elite. The dualsense edge getting removable joysticks and grips raised the price too.

So when its those controllers that this controller will be closer to in terms of features than the base Sony and Xbox controllers. Being only $100 would be a bargain.

I would be happy if I was proved wrong. Please prove me wrong Valve.

Going on off the price of the dualsense edge we will be lucky if it is only a 100 bucks.

Does for me since my main goal is to sit on the couch and use a controller and be able to take advantage of the 4k resolution and the 120 hz panel with freesync on a larger screen and HDR.

And all it took was the price of a hdmi cable to get it to happen versus hundreds or thousand more to get another separate system for the TV.

For PC you can Frankenstein random hardware so you aren’t at the mercy of prebuilt OEM options.

Now look at phones and see how easy it is to make your own from scratch with parts. Then look at OEMs and how many will even let you unlock the bootloader.

Then look at how many iOS options there are for phones not from Apple. Mobile hardware freedom was dead from the get go compared to PC. Why? Hardware roadblocks for mobile compared to PC.

Heroic launcher lets you install games from other launchers although Steam experience is better. But, biggest thing is you can just install Windows, which those who play games that refuse to enable anticheat on Linux will end up doing if this is going to be their main PC.

Like imagine if you could pick up a PS5 or Xbox and install Linux or Windows on it. Id pick one up for that purpose completely negating the reason Sony and Xbox put out the hardware, which is to get people to buy from their store and take 30% of every sale so even if they sold at a loss they are guaranteed to recoup it. Open that hardware up though and they’ll have system that are just going to be a loss.

I’ve wondered for lot of PC gamers why they don’t get a fiber optic hdmi cable to connect their PC to the TV, since seems a waste to have such a powerful machine then be stuck to a monitor when playing a cinematic graphics driven title like Cyberpunk 2077.

Makes sense if the PC is on another floor or too far to do. But, I’ve seen 30m hdmi 2.1 fiber optic cables that can push 4k/120 over that distance.